Discussions

0:00 I want to use your suggestions for the heads of discussion, the more general philosophical topics, for the last part of the meeting, after Corey gets here. This is really intended to take us up to the time of Cartier's departure, in fact it's slightly over us. I think in fact we may well telescope up.

2:30 If we decide not to have an excursion on the Sunday afternoon but to leave that for later, then we could, this could all be finished by the 14th, even by the 14th midday, and then we could have some, quite perhaps, a second meeting to discuss the agenda for this last part of the meeting, the last three days. I confess, I can't remember exactly, I can't remember any ideas, I can't. I can't remember exactly what they are. The opposition of the development of mathematics was driven by fundamental oppositions between the continuous and the discrete. Yes, they were my favorite topics. Yeah, those I certainly think should feature in the show. Yeah, they could go... We should have a more general philosophical day. And obviously when Leah Carr gets there, we should perhaps concentrate at least for one day on Cheap Lips and Oracle. No, it's not a complete agenda, it only goes out for the first four. It's really just the suggestions that people came up with when we talked about this informally yesterday. So when do you want to formulate the minor department agenda? I was going to do it now, but it's already after half past one. I think people are rather keen to eat. Yes, I think we are. So if anybody has any major issues to raise about this... Then shall we just take it as read, and then decide what time we want to discuss the rest of the agenda? Well, we could do that after. We could accept that we are on this agenda.

5:00 We actually want to start the discussion this afternoon with the exposition on Eilenberg and the plane. But I don't think it's going to take... Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Yes, I think we should. No, I mean, we can do it to leave it. Is that the general sense of the meeting, that we should not plan the rest of the agenda until we've had an experience of how this works? Is that a fair story? I think so. When is he coming? He's coming on the very early morning of the 14th, he's actually going to be arriving about 5am, and he'll be here on the 14th, which is also the day that McCarthy will be leaving, not sure what time, I think he'll probably be leaving after 1pm. So I'll overlap, but unfortunately it's probably for one session, for one half day, possibly one full day. McCarthy gets here tonight, I don't know, probably about 7am. I do think, perhaps in that case, it would be better to, well, I'll just make one suggestion, the, the, well, do you mean Wednesday the 15th, you've got Tuesday, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I should, I'm inclined, I'd be inclined to, I'd be inclined to exchange the two, I mean, the foundational stances discussion is clearly, you know, it's going to, it will dovetail much better, I think, into the subsequent ones, I think it ought to be the other way around. Good suggestion, I second it, does anybody have a problem with that? Well, the term topology is this one. Do you think topology stands out here? I mean, I think, actually, originally, I was going to suggest that for this afternoon, but then... I'm sorry, this was tied up so hastily. I was really just taking things down a little bit with all the ways that we can... Well, I think we should exchange. The least thing we do is put two foundational stances at the end. Oh, yes, we have. Motion put the foundational stances. We made the last item on the program, so I'll second if any objections. Okay, second suggestion put by Bill that we should actually move the Discretion of Defense policy to the only amount of the right from the beginning.

7:30 And exchange that on where at the present level we have that open space, which is the same with any problem with that. Well, we've got to do that before we can go to New York. That's the point. I think it might be important that current people come to New York and say, oh, no, I don't know. We'll come back. We've got to come back. Well, then we have... Because I don't want to leave this afternoon, I'm looking like a useless asshole. Well, what do you think? I don't know. If P.P. Allenbrook is going to be the president of the United Nations? I don't know. I mean, it's very difficult to say. I don't know. I mean, I heard Cartier is likely to be the most useful person in the world. I'm just wondering whether Cartier has the expertise, but I think it's far more than me. But has Cartier, does Cartier's work in algebraic geometry and his other interests particularly? touch on the issues involved in the topology and the minimalism of the law. Rob, that's directly in the discussion of Eilenberg and MacLean. I think if it's a case of the two, probably it is one that's of the same pathology today. I agree. Can I put that to the meeting? That's just what you want, right? But then the question is, do we change topology up and just push all this along? Yeah, exactly. That's the suggestion. No more suggestions. No, absolutely. Well, except that we are going to... That was going to be my suggestion as well. Has anybody got a problem with that? Okay, carried. I'll just adjust the... And then everything else is pushed out. I'll just retype it. Well it's one it's actually almost twenty to two now so I think we want to have a reasonably civilized lunch and he is doing it and it should we say at three o'clock and then what I'm going to do well once you're speaking I will probably slip out and go with me me to do

10:00 Practical things like getting in supplies for this evening and... So the only house rule I would like to insist on in connection with that is that the discussions do continue in this room, otherwise it rather defeats the objective of recording them. Okay, let's go. She went off to the cafe. There's not going to be enough time.

22:30 A bottle of vodka, a bottle of vodka, a bottle of vodka, a bottle of vodka, a bottle of vodka, a bottle of vodka, a bottle of vodka, a bottle of vodka, a bottle of vodka, a bottle of vodka. There's only one universe, isn't there? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, because there's only one universe. But you know, it's weird that there's not a, I mean, even now, there's not a textbook model theory which begins with a specific model theory. Although we all do it now. All of a sudden, compelling geometric meaning is what you're trying to do. You make your quantifiers go reset and come back then and say, guess what, you're not going to get it. You won't have any of these things. Well, it's not that you can sort, doesn't it, very quickly? That's right, you're right.

25:00 In the standard histories of logic, of modern logic, of philosophy, they always emphasize class is being a part of that, the tradition, as it were, I mean, certainly from Schroeder and Bohr, and you have to have taken the subject away from its obsession with syntax and one... It's true in many ways, but there seems to be this countervailing tendency that reveals itself in this aspect of its work. But where I find half of my best students in intralogic, they're puzzled by single-sorted languages because they're used to programming.

30:00 You know, in set theory, you're very much defining the equivalence classes. Well, I mean, if you actually look at the integral of arcana by integrals in the absolute left, effectively, it gets over the problem of the equivalence classes by doing 2x. In fact, if you look at the Keynes definition of a representative, they're very few. There's the ordinals, and then there's the cardinals if you've got the absolute fourth. And that is essentially it, unless you impose some official conditions on the structure of the universe, or really tighten the universe up. If you want to take monoisomorphic representatives, say, of ordered sets, or any object of any type of structure, there's no way of making an actual choice. So you're forced to use equivalence. I don't know if you'd say another one. I'll leave it.

32:30 I'm calling. I'm calling a litre, actually it's not a litre, it's a three-quarter, it's a swath of a count. The Italian, you know. The Italian, the chef. Thanks to Jamie Tappan, don't you think? Yeah, it's a... Jamie explained to me how the medievals, these memory palaces, in order to, in fact apparently they used to apply particularly to the memory of the figures of the syllogism. A good idea, yeah. There were various techniques for solving memory palaces, and I'll give you another one. I once taught an intro logic course at a business school in Cleveland that it was Aristotle's They mentioned that there had been advances in logic later than Aristotle, in that one Goclinius in 1635 had discovered that you can chain together a lot of it, all A is B and all B is C and all C is D and so on. The advanced reading at the end of the book explained there were two 20th century authors on logic, Bertrand Russell had written about it, and J. Edgar Hoover had exposed the communists.

35:00 It's almost as good as Russell's saying, but it consisted of his... Chepper. Chepper, that's right. Chepper started as Chepper. I don't know. John E. Goode. John E. Goode. He used the one axiom. He looked at just some very interesting little subjects. Have you read that biography of Russell Graybunk? I've read the second volume, but not the first. The one which reveals how and callingly he behaved towards his children. It doesn't ring a bell, does it? It doesn't ring a bell. Obviously. Especially towards his son's second marriage that I think had a mental, serious mental toll for him. Well, the tone of that biography is markedly different, though. Well, I think because of what very much public about Russell's personality. He's been speaking to his family. This is very good. One for France. Yes, yes. Kept a lot of very good local customs. Not to mention not having any road cells. In one region of France, where there are no road cells, because they still have provisions of the Treaty of Red,

37:30 I think in the 16th century, when Britain became part of the French Crown and the treaty was in force, the French state could, having no road cells in Britain, still not lose. The cells on the algebras tend to start when they cross over into a conglomerate. You basically can't ask directions on foot without somebody offering you an interview. Really? Outside of Paris, I mean, you can't drive, it's pretty busy, but... I was in Le Charbon where... Camus was at this chateau, looked kind of gay, during some time. He wrote a play, and I wanted to go see it. We go into the bookstore and I ask him, can you tell me exactly where it was at Camus? Well, they get on a map, and they show me, and then they find somebody who's driving that way, and they walk up to the truck, and they're like, you know, look at this guy. The car was caught up in an island as well. So I go walking around on the outer part of the ground, which I think is permitted in that part of the country. I see this fellow clipping limbs, and I ask her if I knew the owner. Ah, yes. What is the story? I mean, I know we said we weren't going to exchange anecdotes, but we're not in an official business meeting about the... I don't know if his mother was ever sheltered there. There's some thought that she may have been at some time. Oh, okay, it was him. Were they actually given false identity papers, though? Um, I don't know. Probably they didn't get papers. I think people didn't use their real names, although there's some notes about them by the superintendent. And it was largely a process of deletion then, wasn't it?

40:00 Yes, the Euclidites had a very good record, indeed, of helping to cite the Jews. It was 14 or 15 at the time. So he runs across this German. The day that German division withdrew, as the Allies were approaching, she went in and she tried to avoid anyway, and he addressed her by her real name. And she has no idea what exactly, what he meant by that, how he knew it. Very interesting. Very interesting. It's actually a Chinese. It's actually a Chinese. It's actually a Chinese. It's actually a Chinese. It's actually a Chinese. It's actually a Chinese. ...factory in the north, in the Republic of Canada. I am not sure what name of that factory, but I think it may have been Truss. In fact, it's taken over by the Germans. They used to sell them drugs at the mill, or whatever. ...his father, especially with the weather. And they knew that he had a Jewish wife, so they made sure that there'd be assistance. But then just before the Canadians, it wasn't about the Canadians around the cabinet, just before the Canadians reached the limit, Or an SS officer turned archivist and said, tomorrow at 11 o'clock there's going to be an SS attachment coming in for a white child gift from the working tonight.

42:30 People even in the SS who, for whatever motives, were... And she doesn't know, was he saying, I've been protecting you all along because I knew who you were? Or was he saying, I could have gotten you at any time? I mean, she just has no idea. And nor does Cartier have any idea about whether it was what you'd seen, we knew all along. Or whether it was the last of us, the needle. So try putting a good word for it, I just don't know. I've no idea what that is. But he said that he remembered it. Thank you very much for your time, and I look forward to seeing you again soon. Alex was a big hit with people from the start. He struck people as very energetic and intelligent. He played checkers a lot with the superintendent. He was 13 or 14. Yeah, yeah, 14. 14, yeah. Had he ever been given evidence of extraordinary learning? No, not so far as he describes his autobiography. Yes, you mean, you mean Rodenig wasn't a child, huh? No. He didn't stand out in mathematics to anybody that I've talked to. But he stood out as smart. Oh yeah, yeah. You know, um, not a gauss. No, no, no. Nobody knows what he is. Oh, I'm sure it's something I don't know.

45:00 He didn't talk at all. Yeah. Did he? That's what he said the last, I mean, you know, two years. That's what he said the last two years. Very strange and often a spectator of the story that happened just about nine months ago. It was completely worthless after all because I know the background. The first thing about that month was the nature of that month. I can't remember if it was actually a couple and what happened. I just heard that very late. Okay. It's the worst. It's the worst. It's the worst. It's the worst. It's the worst. It's the worst. It's the worst. It's the worst. It's the worst. It's the worst. There are a number of different types of people involved in the study of mathematics and physics, and we will discuss them in detail in a few minutes. Subtitles by the Amara.org community But just as a straightforward account of what happens when they... Just not on the apple.

47:30 For me, a glass of chocolate, please. No, one or two, that's enough. For me, yes. Would you like a coffee? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? How many cafes do you have? Maybe that's what she, maybe that's what she thought as well, that's why she was a little uncertain. Could be. I give the impression that she's, she checks if you're anglophone and you're speaking French. She wants to check. Not otherwise, yeah. As far as the anglophones who do speak French, I mean, they're more than covered. For English tourists, you get coming into the JRL and trying to make your toes curl. They like to go a long way to avoid, you know. Probably yes, though, because we go to many places. There are a number of different languages in this lecture, and I'm not allowed to talk to the speaker that I'm supposed to be speaking, but look at one of those six speakers that I'm going to talk to if they don't play at the same time. It's very important. How are you all doing? I'm fine, thank you. Thank you.

50:00 I was at a dinner with two of his friends, and he just amazed me. He complained about having to do it all the time. Would you say, Angus, that the depth of the relationship between algebraic logic and model theory really came, to be appreciated, came into play? I'm not quite sure. I'm not sure if I've responded to it or not, but I mean, I'd say approximately, after, without any doubt, after the early 90s, the majority of people doing model theory were doing, men took it for granted, they had to. Some reasonable education in radiography, analytics, and complex engineering. The turning point was probably in ten years or so before Zilber began to see these very general representation theories. So if you had, I'm not expressing too much, but that's the logic of the term, then in fact it was... There was a super-conjecture that it was coming from something very specific, either just a mere set of something like a module or an algebraic form of speech, and although this was not true, the reason for the notion of this conjecture was that it would add in some very natural association with something like science, to prove that all this somehow evolved in 1980 and 1990. Coincidentally for us, by this point, Slayton O'Riordan and Scheller have largely completed his lecture.

52:30 His last review was really good. Like that? I think I might have used that. I think that's really good. Before that, I think it was rather more... Yeah, but from the very beginning, you look at the kind of examples considered, but you have problems with that. You could also count Pyrrhicon, his general, his general, his general, his general, his general, his general, his general, his general, his general, his general, his general, his general, his general, Thank you for watching. There were very few examples of the conspicuous area of Lyon in South Korea. You don't see terms falling out of spaces here, do you? I mean, for us. Yeah, yeah. Maybe not so good for them. I mean, people are actually... I mean, Zilber was the one bold enough to... Yeah. This is really... Look. You know what I mean? The resonance... The models might be built out of these... It's involved in commercial... Yeah. These were the fundamental...

55:00 Yeah. That's not quite right. We've got a few more. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for your attention. I mean, again, of course, it's foolish, and I didn't think he was taking on this focus. So, I mean, he described the uncertainty and uncertainty is some of the most important things. People would let it. They knew the uncertainty completely. But it's possible, so I don't know. I'm promising, as far as I can tell. ...regarded by the power statement. Although one knows that there are letters. Subsequently, there was the sense that Robinson was getting, he was using a little more, I mean, they thought they were doing a little more. I got it. Oh, no, it's her hand back there. Sorry, excuse me. I was going to ask how Robinson and his, the two of you, how did you learn that? I mean, Robinson, in contrast to him, didn't look out to the world of mathematics to see what was going on, you know, and see what was coming up, and what he could say in his time, even at the very end, you know, if it was published, he would try to write something in generic categories.

57:30 I don't know if his mind was open to Cambridge. Robinson? Yeah. Oh, yeah, I heard the talk, I guess, early on. Yeah, that's right. This is a non-standard version of the category of human groups, making some use of that. You see, this was regarded somehow rather by a soft model theory, because one was using essentially only the compactness theory, but sometimes rather the exaggerated way. Whereas they were working with, they would be working with many types of theory. But also with something that's exceedingly difficult except for the chromatography of the things that are normal. What you're doing is very difficult. You know, a surprising amount of us. I mean, people like Vaughn, who was really an exception to the other people, they had a very nice touch in these classic things. I mean, he spent a great deal of time on these... I mean, these things were desperately hard. And, of course, Jensen saw that these things could be attained in a perceptive way, but they've never been really very defensive, have they? He wasn't part of that set theory, you know, on the street at all, because that felt a weak way on, and it was also a problem with my mathematics. Well, as Angus just said, I'd be much more in contact with what was going on in the rest of mathematics. Several seminars at Yale, for instance, before he got sick, you know, this thing coming out, you know, I'm aware of what this colloquial was all about. He was already thinking, well, what can I take from this? Where can I situate it relative to what I know already? What can I do with it?

1:00:00 Of course, there sometimes are things you can do. Again, you know, things that he did then, like this creation of differentially-closed fields, it looked a little bit artificial at the time, because it's an example, one of the examples for the unknown. Natural examples of nature. No, what's that differential? You know, you get from some sort of limits of achievable complex plane, we don't really have any... Sorry, I didn't quite catch what you said. Differentially closed fields. Differentially closed fields, yes. Basically, he found it. Rather than finding universal domains, say differential algebra, he found the axis of that universal domain, but there was no visible universal domain. I mean, there is, there are such models, but they don't come out. And there are various things about it that are almost indelible in the subject, but it's a curious thing, and terrible. In our non-magic show, the person, Anton Shavsky, showed that this is the right way into quite a few finite mysterious things. And later, it was one thing that was done for existentialist difference, so it's not very differential, but it's a difference of nature. Now, these things, I did the second one, not with any huge applications, just because Robinson had done it, but because it was more complicated. Krzykowski used it, again, in that kind of film. This kind of activity was never done with Tarski. They didn't do it. It was, I mean, it was pretty much a clash. There were some people who began as Tarskians and somehow... Well, it's an amazing, very striking phenomenon, the set theory, you know, the decline. I mean, the few people, there are... Few people really still, it's very difficult, I mean, the people around Witten and the people around Connes, there's two very powerful groups that are doing exceptionally difficult and very beautiful stuff, but that's it. For example, in Britain, for some reason, it's gone. I mean, I sometimes get blamed for that, but this was not at all my purpose. I mean, it just sort of happened.

1:02:30 This is why John Mayberry's son-in-law has gone out and says it works great. I don't know much about Robot. Well, I didn't actually meet Robot. I've been in the same room with Robot, but he was notoriously shy and reclusive. I knew him quite well. I knew John Mayberry and Brian Rotman. Yeah, I know Brian. He's a very good friend of mine. I mean, I spent a year in Bristol after he started for Knights Bleu, especially to have contact with Robert. Of course, he used to be a sailor. He was a very curious guy. He had psychological difficulties. Yeah, I mean, it's clear he was at a certain point. He was a precursor of Charles Atkinson as far as stability was concerned, and of course he did significant work in the same area as Jack Silver and so on and so on, and it worked still beyond Wooden's program, but it's clear he was a very odd character. He also, I guess, had a very serious commitment to music, right? Yes, he's a very good pianist. I take it he's no longer with us. He's living in Glossop or somewhere like that. Glossop, that's right. He went back north. He took early retirement to Bristol a long time ago. Yes. John Maverson is still in touch with him. Yes, I think he probably is. I took it for granted I would have contacts with him, I think, because he was a wee fellow at the time. But people have recounted to me other stories. You know, he retired when Dana Scott was around. He was too nervous to talk to people and stuff. He didn't, after he went to, you know, he did his PhD, he was at Cambridge, and he did his PhD in Wisconsin, but he didn't, he didn't, which is, of course, he wrote this remarkable piece, which was his only publication, apart from the book he wrote later with one of his students, Chapman, he only published that one paper, which was a major work, I mean, it was his thesis, and that was it. He stopped doing research of any unpublishable kind. For a long time, and so he only published, as I say, one paper plus this book. He had this student, I was his examiner for PhD. I can't remember his first name. I can't remember his first name. But anyway, no, Fred was very reclusive. He also had a very strange, he had a peculiar, very strange marriage. He got divorced to an American woman he met at an American concert. I mean, very difficult.

1:05:00 Yeah, well, he didn't get a succession because he got interested in it. And he had, at first, a very good guy, John Zangler. Now, John Zangler just left mathematics altogether, after all. He didn't do anything more than that. I don't know, he set up, he was in Buffalo for a while. What was he? Then he gave up. And he was, Fred was, well, he worked well. Fred was very pleased with him, and they did... In collaboration, I think he did great work, quite a bit with his students, but nothing, except in Chapman's case, nothing, you know, kind of emerged to him. I never studied this book very much. I looked into it at first glance. It didn't seem very interesting. Later, I regretted not having looked more closely, because I wondered in particular whether he ever applied that sort of material. No, I doubt it. He just puts it out there. And if he'd written that in about three years, the book might have had some influence. By the time it appeared, you had fiber categories and index categories, and you were familiar groups with the developers of your own. And he'd sort of hammered it together, was my perspective. Maybe I'm missing some insight in it, but it seemed to me there wasn't an insight in it. Well, he was trying to say he was interested in it. He must have had some purpose in developing it. Yes, well, he was a logician and he was interested in the idea of producing a proper formal language for describing one topic, the topic is defined over and over and over again. That was what he was interested in. So that's the end you're thinking about? Well, I think that was the primary motivation, of course. Not any purpose, not that.

1:07:30 Well, I think that was the primary motivation. Because there's a... What we might do, yeah but look, they take credit cards. They do. Well I will pay for it, you know, I will pay with credit cards and you pay me. Okay. Yeah. Alright? Yeah, except I'm going to have to go to a distributor because I think I'm a bit short on cash. Can I owe you? It's $18. Wait a minute, actually I think I probably have it. I've got some change. It's $14. You don't need it now? Actually, I can just do it, Don. Well, why don't you pick, because we'll get some more cash, you know, I'll give it by coin, and I can give you some change, because Mimi doesn't have any. I'll give you some change. It doesn't look like we're going to have three. So how much? You get one, I'll take it. I'll give you some change. How much is your order? Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. Take it. I owe you about one and a half euros. No, seriously, it's not that big of a deal. Well, it's just all my loose change now. I have to go to the distributor as well. Well, it's almost 3 o'clock now. Is it really? Yes, it's about 5 minutes to about 4. So we'll say 3.15 to be official and make a move. Let's give people a chance to... D'est-ce que tu m'as argent? D'est-ce que tu m'as argent? For a cash machine? No, distributeur. Distributeur. So there's a trend now, unfortunately, to the VA. People are, you know, allegedly flying category theory, coco theory, twistor theory, set theory, but in fact, they're just sort of playing around with stuff like that on that level, trying to just jump from set theory to set theory and consider it, like measurable cardinals, like construction sets. Thank you. You know, we know a little bit about it, but looking at fixed-point arrows. Many are looking at embedding theorems, categorical theorems. I think that would be probably, if you had a grad student, tell them to do that. I'm not going to do it. I don't plan on doing it in the near future.

1:10:00 Yeah, I mean, that's it. So, the next physical movement I want to see on the graph. So, a robot. This could be related to glucose theory. Thank you very much for your time, and I look forward to seeing you again in the future. They don't present it in a way, you know, the original way. Things with measurable cardinals, I mean, the definition is... The 70-year-olds themselves can only tell you the definition of optoisomorphism. They don't care how you define which ones are cardinals. But indiscernible, well there's lots of indiscernible in the elementary Theory of the Category of Sex, but that's the easy kind, not the kind that matters. Capturing the kind that matters in math settings is not, to my mind, routine, and so it's worth looking at.

1:12:30 And yet, the rest of the article, the books about them, all the time, let's start to do this, let's do that, the second part of the article is totally uttered as exposition, it's here's no time, it won't steal it, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, it's this one, No, that was their basic idea was that this must be hard. It's the same thing as McLean says. Not the same thing as McLean says at all. Not at all. Yes it is. It's a category theory saying steps are bad. Very logical people. Very logical people. I'll give him a machine. It's going to be really hard for him. Oh, yes, okay. Yes, that's an excellent suggestion.

1:15:00 Is there anything you need me to print off from here before I give you... ...for 20 minutes to start, and then probably just slip quietly out and do the various practical things that need to be done, and, oh, I can't, you'll want to call me back. I think I will, in fact, come with you this afternoon, but I don't really know anything about tape. Okay, okay. Well, that solves the problem about getting people on the... Exactly, exactly. The printer is, is, you want the, no, no, that closes the whole thing. You want the printer, it's there. So I've printed this already. Oh, you've reprinted it? Oh, I actually printed it, I saw. Yeah, I saw you. I really wanted to. I was reading the proofreads. Right. Let's do a bit of work in here, obviously, tidying up. In that case, give us about 20 minutes, John. Sure, yeah, absolutely. I just want to, I want to get the, okay, John and Mimi and I are going to go to, because John feels he's not going to have to make much input on this stuff. I've been part of many, many discussions that I was not able to contribute to, and they were the ones I got out of them. This education is exposure to an elevated mind. You just fold them up, that would be quite helpful.

1:17:30 ...to go with it, which I just took in and took off without. Like in the centre, it's about there, isn't it? It's somewhere, yeah. It was north of Canterley and the Cessna. Yes, absolutely. Yes, that's what it is. It's the only time I've ever been to Sicily. Oh, no, no, no, that's right. I actually have been a year before. I've sat once and heard it twice, but I've never been to Sicily.

1:20:00 I love, I love Montenegro. I mean, and the valley of Montenegro. I've been there. No, I've never been there. Montenegro doing eruptions, and that was mine. It was mine. It wasn't the time he went, was it? You could get him up before. I should see the last one. Of course, Vesuvius is now overdue for eruption. They know how much, I mean, obviously not the exact science, but they know that they get about 48 hours a week if they have another, you know, a really spectacular lecture. Curious, one of the major players nowadays in all minimality. But keeps it very quiet because unless he's talking to someone else. Something he does now is keep media weather forecasting, doesn't he? And he plays around with ideas about, you know, about hidden variables theories, specific and variable theories, but in a really nice way that I think is physically a lot more serious than many of the others.

1:22:30 I was glad to hear that. In fact, he's coming next month to this meeting they have every year in Ascot on foundations of physics. I mean, Julian Hunt, a student of his in Cambridge. He's a good expositor. When you say running the show, what do you mean? Well, he used to be director. No, he's no longer. He's Lord. No, no, no. Russell. He had some title before he actually had it. You have courtesy title. You have courtesy title. There's still a lot that we're not allowed to remain as a program. All of this work, including of course, who very sadly died last year, Conrad Russel, Russel's son. Yes, he did very sadly, Conrad Russel, who was an extremely fine historian, 17th century historian, professor of history at King's College London, and a really outstanding man, I mean really, in terms of defending civil liberties. Now, I'm talking about 16, because he was the son of Russel's old age.

1:25:00 It's a really impressive guy, and there are a couple of cases he fought. For instance, he had a student in his history, one of his students at King's, who was falsely accused on that day. He was kicked out without having been given any anger about it. He decided to fight. He just used this man until his accuser was properly cross-examined and the evidence tested. It was, of course, a complete issue. And the guy was eventually restored and allowed to take his degree, but I hate to say it, but I don't think there were that many supervisors who could be relied on to fight their pupils with quite the same degree of principles. No, he's a very impressive man, but sadly he died quite suddenly. But when they had this selection, they went there, fulfilled the commitment, which is to abolish the line of the grid and continue to vote. Since they couldn't agree on the new legislation for the comprehensive reform of the second chamber, because Blair wants this absolutely outrageous system where by effect it will just be appointed by the prime minister. I mean, he must have legally had it. He's working in his office. Just by his say so. I mean, it is literally as if the executive branch just decided from now on we appoint members of the senate. Aiden was a leader of the corporates that they were allowed some credit. Well, he's not going to be able to, thank God now he's lost so much of his majority, he's not going to be able to push that through if he will allow direct elections for the whole country. So how do people get all of that? Because then there would be a clear demand for a proper by Campbell system with a greatly increased power for all of them. He doesn't want him on the very end of the second chapter. But I had no idea these changes had happened at all. Oh, it's not long ago. It was simply around here. Oh no, it was a long time. It was the 50s since he was purely rich.

1:27:30 To me that's not long ago. I replayed that. Alright. And what's the alternative? What is it now? What is it? I mean, it's a mixture. The majority now are life peers, people who are applied for life. So they're appointed. Each of the parties gets a certain amount. And then there are also certain reserve nominations for kind of non-political cross-ventures. For instance, the Eiffel, I think the Royal Society has allowed a certain number of nominations. I'm not, that's not official. I mean, like, you're Prince of Wales, you know. No, no, no, the military titles all had some particular portion of them, but for instance, the Duke of, the Duke of, who's the guy whose place they used to film the Harry Potter films, I can't think, but anyway. Scott, yeah, he's doing Scott. The, um, I don't know, no, okay, oh, that's fine, the Duke of Shack.

1:30:00 Yeah, the Duke of Shack, which is no way the Duke of Shack at all, it's in the... Some of the titles have come down from critics and aristocrats who dominated the parliamentary system in the 17th and 18th centuries. Some of them are the ones that Henry VIII basically argued about. People still remember that they became clear that it is possible to create many of the written titles. There have been no creations since 1916. I just want to say, we're sitting right at the back there, in your splendid lawn there. Okay, look, I'm sorry, we're delayed going off at a tangent. That's my fault entirely. Shall we gather? And this is now working flipchart, so if anybody needs to use it, start recording us and then just leave it up there. It's the 10th of June, 2005, and... This is the session on technical technology and the algebra and algebra program that's run with the patients, taking place in Bouguere, with the discussants being Bill O'Berry and his management on the project. So I thought I would... One of the first things is the category theory.